Burman Extended

[Wyo2dal]

Is Burman the best AD in the world? No he is not. However he is a pretty solid AD and has come up with good hires with a limited budget to do it with. DC was a good hire, he didn't work here because it wasn't a good fit for him and the culture wasn't right. Heath was a terrible decision we have been over that. Shyatt was a great hire, Branch was a fantastic hire and wrestling is the best in it's history. Swimming is very good and will get better after facility upgrade that's coming. Volleyball is on the rise and has a very good coach, longest winning streak in conference in our history in his first year. Bohl appears to be a very good hire and at the very least a great ambassador for the program and state. Burman is obviously very respected by peers to be the mountain west representative for the playoff. In my opinion he grades at a 7/10 and that is a pretty good grade for a school of our size and budget restrictions. The main problem as I see it is a lack of funding support from the state, and you can blame Burman if you would like to, but nobody has any luck squeezing much from this state legislature no matter what the money is for and you will never convince me a new AD would do better at that. Burman deserves time to see if the big three of Shyatt, Branch, and Bohl works out for us and if it doesn't then you can start calling for his head, but he deserves at minimum three to four more years.

From what I recall a Consulting Group for UW in some way shape or form was involved with the most recent hires from DC to Shyatt and even partially for Bohl. While I don't discredit Burman on those hires I also only see him as making direct hiring decisions that have negatively impacted UW.

The way I see it Burman had opportunities to do it as his own without consulting group assistance and failed miserably.

Don't get me wrong there are a ton of things that an AD does that we don't see that he has probably done a good job with but if you look at Burman for what we see regularly he has failed regularly.

[WYO1016]

The grass ain't always greener on the other side, folks. Is Burman a world beater? Absolutely not. However, he's a hell of a lot better than Lee Moon was. He's been our whipping boy on this board for quite a while, but AD's can sure as hell get a LOT worse than Tom Burman. Look at the debacle going on in Hawaii right now. Look at the AD that Nevada fired. CSU currently has a dumpster fire on their hands with the Moonlight Graham saga.

I'm a fence rider on this issue. Burman says a lot of things that make me see red, but he's done a good job in other areas. Yes, we're mediocre, but we seem to be trending upwards lately. I don't feel like Burman's earned this extension, but he certainly doesn't deserve to be shown the door.

[Wyo2dal]

I don't see our sports as Mediocre I see them as poor except for wrestling which I consider above average because they are actually deserving of P5 status.

[ragtimejoe1]

I guess we will all have to agree to disagree. For me, Burman single handedly tanked the bball program. Not only that, the 3 biggest budgets in the MWC leave and we bring in a bunch of WAC teams. Our budgets are still among the worst in the MWC. Our attendance in bball is in a free fall--remember the days of 10K? Football attendance hasn't even sniffed a 25K average. Our WYO brand is a bunch of fluff about Cowboy Tough, but reality is we are joked about for ugly uniforms and losing.

I don't see how being near the bottom of the MWC in revenue sports and being near the bottom in the MWC in budgets could be much worse.

Like I said; agree to disagree, I guess.

[stymeman]

i'm hoping it's a put up or ship out year for Burman, i understand they need him to be here for Bohl's 1st year but if those pieces crumble, both football and bball, then i think it's time for Mr Burman to move along

[VisorHair]

Yes, Burman has pissed me off with things he's said in interviews in the past, but this continued crybabying heading into the Bohl/Shyatt/Branch era is really getting old. I think we have a SOLID set of head coaches here now who will FINALLY get things done over time. They are all highly respected by their peers.

AD 101: coaches can't do squat if they aren't given the right tools. Our toolbox is on par with the worst in the MWC.

Oh well, as long as we hire new coaches every 4 to 5 years to pump sunshine up fans' behinds, then all is good. As long as we state how much we'd like to get or what we'd like to do, all is good. As long as we make everyone in the country know how remote and pathetic WYO is so recruiting suffers, I guess all is good.

poop, we expect the President of the US to turn around an entire country in 4 to 8 years. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect an AD to increase attendance and actually increase our position in the MWC--especially when the top teams leave. Burman has done none of this. The ONLY thing he has done is hire Bohl and Shyatt and some facility upgrades. The question is, could ONLY Burman have done that? My guess isn't just no but hell no.

We couldn't be much, if any, worse off with someone else. If it can't get any worse, it aint much of a risk to try something new.

Hahahaha. You've lost it. And increased ticket revenue and raised more money than ever before.. But yet you're contradicting yourself here Wyo has top facilities (a critical tool) increased budgets for all major sports (a critical tool) - what other tools you looking for to that help coaches win besides money and facilities? You want him to recruit? You're funny.

And where do we rank in the MWC? Extend him for another 10 years, I don't need to see a championship in my lifetime.

Rank in what category? Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel. Budget is middle of the pack, donors is top 3, money raised is top 5 or so I believe. And all of that has happened under his watch. Anything else?

[ragtimejoe1]

Rank in what category? Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel. Budget is middle of the pack, donors is top 3, money raised is top 5 or so I believe. And all of that has happened under his watch. Anything else?

You need to reread the stats. We don't sniff the middle of the pack in budgets. Middle is 6 and I don't think we are above 8th in any budget related category.

Here: I'll help get you started.. http://trib.com/sports/college/wyoming/ ... 3d991.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[BeaverPoke]

Our WYO brand is a bunch of fluff about Cowboy Tough, but reality is we are joked about for ugly uniforms and losing.

Haha!
I said this exact thing on here once and got F***ing crucified!



But I've learned that if you are really hopeful but also realize where we stand in the grand scheme of things, people love to shoot the messenger.

[VisorHair]

Rank in what category? Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel. Budget is middle of the pack, donors is top 3, money raised is top 5 or so I believe. And all of that has happened under his watch. Anything else?

You need to reread the stats. We don't sniff the middle of the pack in budgets. Middle is 6 and I don't think we are above 8th in any budget related category.

Here: I'll help get you started.. http://trib.com/sports/college/wyoming/ ... 3d991.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Budget is right under $30M. I can't find the link but they're right around middle of the pack. You're looking at 12-13 coaching salary pools which were upped when Bohl came on. So, here we go again with the money that is coming in at a record high and the legislature lobbying. What else?

[ragtimejoe1]

Budget is right under $30M. I can't find the link but they're right around middle of the pack. You're looking at 12-13 coaching salary pools which were upped when Bohl came on. So, here we go again with the money that is coming in at a record high and the legislature lobbying. What else?

From the article

“Bottom line is, we’re a long way between where the middle of the league is and where we are [financially]," Wyoming athletic director Tom Burman said this week. "We need to make up ground, and make up ground pretty quick. So, how do we do that?

Record highs? It damn well better be record high each year or you are not keeping up with inflation. Why is it so hard for you to understand that position relative to peers is the metric that matters and we suck. It is like saying, "hooray! we ran the mile 1/10th of a second faster" while everyone else knocks a minute off of theirs. It might be your record best but you are still getting your tail kicked.

Oh well, some of us hate losing and some of us accept excuses for it.

[JimmyDimes]

For the record, I wanted Burman gone last year. There is nothing we as fans can do about the extension he was given. Nothing at all. So instead of bitching like a bunch of babies, why not get excited about the football season. At least we will see if the latest hire was a good or bad one. If good, we should be thrilled (some probably wont' regardless). If bad, it is another strike against Burman and hopefully his ticket out of the AD office.

Good things are on the horizon. Start winning and the rest will take care of itself.

Go Pokes!!

[JimmyDimes]

Our WYO brand is a bunch of fluff about Cowboy Tough, but reality is we are joked about for ugly uniforms and losing.

Haha!
I said this exact thing on here once and got F***ing crucified!



But I've learned that if you are really hopeful but also realize where we stand in the grand scheme of things, people love to shoot the messenger.

That is the Wyoming brand. Unfortunately, we haven't seen a coach embrace it since Dimel. Cowboy tough also means not giving a poop about what others think of our uniforms. I love them and could care less what other people think. It doesn't hurt my feelings at all if someone else doesn't like our color scheme.

[Wyo2dal]

Ok this post is going to be image heavy because I can't be bothered to type out all these lines. This is a 2005-2013 breakdown in expenses for every MWC School. Wyoming is 9th in expenses and yes I know this doesn't cover 2014 but if you think we came up 4 million between 2013 and 2014 that is just crazy talk.

[ragtimejoe1]

To add in to Wyo2Dal's point here are revenues (pretty much the same as expenses but notice the changes for the schools in our Mtn Division....

Wyoming $24 million to $29 million = + $5 million
NM $36 million to $44 million = + $8 million
CSU $23 million to $34 million = + $11 million
USU $13 million to $23 million = + $10 million
BSU $25 million to $43 million = + $18 million
AF $30 million to $39 million = +9 million

Yep, Burman has done a bang up job of keeping up.

[VisorHair]

Budget is right under $30M. I can't find the link but they're right around middle of the pack. You're looking at 12-13 coaching salary pools which were upped when Bohl came on. So, here we go again with the money that is coming in at a record high and the legislature lobbying. What else?

From the article

“Bottom line is, we’re a long way between where the middle of the league is and where we are [financially]," Wyoming athletic director Tom Burman said this week. "We need to make up ground, and make up ground pretty quick. So, how do we do that?

Record highs? It damn well better be record high each year or you are not keeping up with inflation. Why is it so hard for you to understand that position relative to peers is the metric that matters and we suck. It is like saying, "hooray! we ran the mile 1/10th of a second faster" while everyone else knocks a minute off of theirs. It might be your record best but you are still getting your tail kicked.

Oh well, some of us hate losing and some of us accept excuses for it.

Look, read Wyo2Dal's post. See the growth? Why is it so hard for you to understand he is landlocked yet is growing despite it? Are you not business savvy orrrrrr are you slow? $$$$$$$$$$$$ wins in college athletics and its coming in. Wyo is a special case that needs more $ from the state, we can't get $ from the national government like AF, we don't get BCS $ and more TV $ like Boise, etc. Check UNLV's.. they are BROKE! They start winning at a higher level, then more opportunities will arise. Winning puts fans in seats, donations increase, TV $'s get more abundant, sponsorships rise, EVERYTHING increases. Despite all this new $ coming in they are still middle to lower tier in MWC. So, I really am confused in what you're wanting despite the growth. It needs to come in and grow more, obviously. Hopefully the legislature pulls through to help catapult them. That's it from me on this subject.

Here's to eventually winning and bringing in more money!

[jessejames02]

Rank in what category? Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel. Budget is middle of the pack, donors is top 3, money raised is top 5 or so I believe. And all of that has happened under his watch. Anything else?

You're not serious are you?

The only category that matters: Wins!

[WestWYOPoke]

Is Burman the best AD in the world? No he is not. However he is a pretty solid AD and has come up with good hires with a limited budget to do it with. DC was a good hire, he didn't work here because it wasn't a good fit for him and the culture wasn't right. Heath was a terrible decision we have been over that. Shyatt was a great hire, Branch was a fantastic hire and wrestling is the best in it's history. Swimming is very good and will get better after facility upgrade that's coming. Volleyball is on the rise and has a very good coach, longest winning streak in conference in our history in his first year. Bohl appears to be a very good hire and at the very least a great ambassador for the program and state. Burman is obviously very respected by peers to be the mountain west representative for the playoff. In my opinion he grades at a 7/10 and that is a pretty good grade for a school of our size and budget restrictions. The main problem as I see it is a lack of funding support from the state, and you can blame Burman if you would like to, but nobody has any luck squeezing much from this state legislature no matter what the money is for and you will never convince me a new AD would do better at that. Burman deserves time to see if the big three of Shyatt, Branch, and Bohl works out for us and if it doesn't then you can start calling for his head, but he deserves at minimum three to four more years.

This is the biggest misconception I see on this board. UW athletics gets more money from the state than probably ANY other D1 school in the country! Most schools get less than 10% of their revenue from the state general fund. We get a lot more than that. Having said that, it is the ADs job to find other sources of revenue. We can't rely on the state to pony up every dime we need, we have to go out and find it elsewhere instead of running to Cheyenne with our hat in our hand.

[Wyolie Coyote]

Rank in what category? Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel. Budget is middle of the pack, donors is top 3, money raised is top 5 or so I believe. And all of that has happened under his watch. Anything else?

You're not serious are you?

The only category that matters: Wins!

Exactly. Wins and championships are how an AD should be ultimately measured.

[McPeachy]

Rank in what category? Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel. Budget is middle of the pack, donors is top 3, money raised is top 5 or so I believe. And all of that has happened under his watch. Anything else?

You're not serious are you?

The only category that matters: Wins!

Exactly. Wins and championships are how an AD should be ultimately measured.

"Facilities top 3 with new AA remodel" - which happened under his watch. His watch? LMFGDAO!

Tom Burman had NOTHING to do with the facility upgrades at Wyoming. And he certainly did "watch" but that was all he did.

[NowherePoke]

Is Burman the best AD in the world? No he is not. However he is a pretty solid AD and has come up with good hires with a limited budget to do it with. DC was a good hire, he didn't work here because it wasn't a good fit for him and the culture wasn't right. Heath was a terrible decision we have been over that. Shyatt was a great hire, Branch was a fantastic hire and wrestling is the best in it's history. Swimming is very good and will get better after facility upgrade that's coming. Volleyball is on the rise and has a very good coach, longest winning streak in conference in our history in his first year. Bohl appears to be a very good hire and at the very least a great ambassador for the program and state. Burman is obviously very respected by peers to be the mountain west representative for the playoff. In my opinion he grades at a 7/10 and that is a pretty good grade for a school of our size and budget restrictions. The main problem as I see it is a lack of funding support from the state, and you can blame Burman if you would like to, but nobody has any luck squeezing much from this state legislature no matter what the money is for and you will never convince me a new AD would do better at that. Burman deserves time to see if the big three of Shyatt, Branch, and Bohl works out for us and if it doesn't then you can start calling for his head, but he deserves at minimum three to four more years.

This is the biggest misconception I see on this board. UW athletics gets more money from the state than probably ANY other D1 school in the country! Most schools get less than 10% of their revenue from the state general fund. We get a lot more than that. Having said that, it is the ADs job to find other sources of revenue. We can't rely on the state to pony up every dime we need, we have to go out and find it elsewhere instead of running to Cheyenne with our hat in our hand.

I agree with the premise (we are already well supported by the state, need to generate alternate revenue sources), but the current status is not quite as bad as you state.

While athletic budgets are notoriously difficult to compare, due to inconsistent accounting practices, USA Today did a study last year on this topic. The list can be found here: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/ ... /finances/

You can see that Wyoming is 47th (out of 230 reporting institutions) in terms of total subsidy. As a percentage, UW is actually only 149/230. Of course, that is looking at all D1. A more honest evaluation would be to look at how Wyoming compares among FBS schools since FCS schools are heavily subsidy dependent. A quick look there suggests we are somewhere in the 30's out of 120 or so schools.

So, the fact is UW is pretty heavily dependent upon institutional support. However, one could argue that Wyoming is in a little bit different position than most of the other FBS schools that are heavily subsidy dependent (concentrated in the MAC, Sun Belt, etc.) in that UW is the only 4 year institution in a state that has pretty significant per capita resources and very high levels of overall institutional state support outside of athletics.

Long story short, our only chance is to dramatically increase funding from both public and private sources and to do so in the very near future. Is Burman the leader to make that happen? When Burman took over, UW had a larger athletic budget than CSU. They now exceed ours by $5M. How did that occur?