Game Thread: Montanta State @ Wyoming

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:06 am

carbonpoke wrote:did you guys pay attention defensively to marshals minutes. is he better enough than j. mc? Jason has paid a very heavy price to get the minutes he has. and, he is extremely lethal from beyond the arc.

not saying that the jc transfer isn't the better drive and dish player... but not so sure about him being the better "all around shyatt player"

defense, taking good shot, and understanding the design... pretty sure that is why he is on the bench.

See what seattlecowboy posted. Marshall has a much higher ceiling as a player than JMac does.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:32 am

Although we rebounded much better vs. Mt. State, Shyatt will be forced to play Marshall if we keep getting killed on the boards.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:33 am

calpoke25 wrote:
carbonpoke wrote:did you guys pay attention defensively to marshals minutes. is he better enough than j. mc? Jason has paid a very heavy price to get the minutes he has. and, he is extremely lethal from beyond the arc.

not saying that the jc transfer isn't the better drive and dish player... but not so sure about him being the better "all around shyatt player"

defense, taking good shot, and understanding the design... pretty sure that is why he is on the bench.
See what seattlecowboy posted. Marshall has a much higher ceiling as a player than JMac does.

Nothing but love for JMac, he has earned every minute he has gotten. That being said, Marshall is a superior athlete, has shown he can slash and finish, and has shown the ability to hit the 3. I don't want to say one is better than they other, I think they both should be on the floor with Adams, James, and Herndon. That would be a great lineup

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:50 am

Just to clarify my statement I didn't mean to come across that anyone on here is stupid or that I think Shyatt is dumb but that is part of my point is I don't think Shyatt is a dumb coach so I think there is something up because it doesn't make any sense for Marshall to not be playing just because Shyatt doesn't think he is as good as the other guys on the team.

The only reason at all I can come up with for something like that being the case is Marshall isn't doing something on defense that Shyatt wants because offensively and athletically he is as good as anyone on the team except for maybe Adams.
He was also listed as one of the top 25 JUCO impact players in the country coming into this year. He was rated #18 or #19. I would have to find the article. You could see from the two games he got more minutes in how good he was but ever since the first two games Shyatt has only giving him 2 minutes of garbage time. No real minutes at all to do anything. Just doesn't add up.

Wish Gags or Holmgren would press the issue a little bit to find out what is up. If it is some secret that is kept in house with in the team that is fine but just say that is what is up so we don't speculate why one of the better players is riding the bench. I guess Shyatt doesn't have to tell us anything but wish he would.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:53 am

After watching this team for some games I'd like to see what a lineup of Herndon, James, Marshall, JMac/Washington and Adams could do.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:56 am

seattlecowboy wrote:
BackHarlowRoad wrote:Do we really have a big enough sample size on Marshall to assume he's a fantastic player getting screwed on minutes? He played really well against Bristol (a USCAA team whose conference website has all teams with a 0-0 win/loss record, seriously, wtf). What else do we have? 9 minutes against D-II Ft Lewis, 2 minutes against Indiana State, 2 minutes against D-II NMHU.

I trust that Shyatt has very good reason to make the lineup choices that he makes.

P.S. I've never even heard of the USCAA until I tried finding out what division Bristol was in.

Yeah we have a big enough sample size. I have watched enough basketball in my time and can tell a good player when he is on the court. The minutes he has gotten he plays better and is by FAR a better athlete than anyone else on the team except for Adams. Anyone that can't tell he isn't the 2nd best player on the team is either stupid or has never watched basketball before. So there is for sure something up with it . Either that or Shyatt is dumber than I thought.

If Coach Shyatt is holding Marshall out of the games, I'm sure there is a damn good reason for doing so.
In regard to your last comment about Shyatt being dumb -

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:58 am

WYCowboy wrote:
seattlecowboy wrote:
BackHarlowRoad wrote:Do we really have a big enough sample size on Marshall to assume he's a fantastic player getting screwed on minutes? He played really well against Bristol (a USCAA team whose conference website has all teams with a 0-0 win/loss record, seriously, wtf). What else do we have? 9 minutes against D-II Ft Lewis, 2 minutes against Indiana State, 2 minutes against D-II NMHU.

I trust that Shyatt has very good reason to make the lineup choices that he makes.

P.S. I've never even heard of the USCAA until I tried finding out what division Bristol was in.

Yeah we have a big enough sample size. I have watched enough basketball in my time and can tell a good player when he is on the court. The minutes he has gotten he plays better and is by FAR a better athlete than anyone else on the team except for Adams. Anyone that can't tell he isn't the 2nd best player on the team is either stupid or has never watched basketball before. So there is for sure something up with it . Either that or Shyatt is dumber than I thought.
If Coach Shyatt is holding Marshall out of the games, I'm sure there is a damn good reason for doing so.
In regard to your last comment about Shyatt being dumb -

Read what I wrote. I never said Shyatt was dumb . You took it the wrong way.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 9:01 am

seattlecowboy wrote:
WYCowboy wrote:
seattlecowboy wrote:
BackHarlowRoad wrote:Do we really have a big enough sample size on Marshall to assume he's a fantastic player getting screwed on minutes? He played really well against Bristol (a USCAA team whose conference website has all teams with a 0-0 win/loss record, seriously, wtf). What else do we have? 9 minutes against D-II Ft Lewis, 2 minutes against Indiana State, 2 minutes against D-II NMHU.

I trust that Shyatt has very good reason to make the lineup choices that he makes.

P.S. I've never even heard of the USCAA until I tried finding out what division Bristol was in.

Yeah we have a big enough sample size. I have watched enough basketball in my time and can tell a good player when he is on the court. The minutes he has gotten he plays better and is by FAR a better athlete than anyone else on the team except for Adams. Anyone that can't tell he isn't the 2nd best player on the team is either stupid or has never watched basketball before. So there is for sure something up with it . Either that or Shyatt is dumber than I thought.
If Coach Shyatt is holding Marshall out of the games, I'm sure there is a damn good reason for doing so.
In regard to your last comment about Shyatt being dumb -
Read what I wrote. I never said Shyatt was dumb . You took it the wrong way.

I suppose I should have phrased it a different way so my fault for the way it was typed. But i already clarified myself in a couple of posts above.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:21 am

We might need to calm down on Marshall speculation for a few weeks. If he did indeed tweak that ankle...poop that can just put you out and behind for a bit. It might not be worth risking him this early against MTST at home and pushing through an injury like that. Even if he said he's healthy well sometimes athletes say poop like that just to play because they are competitive. I over speculated and retracted my statements about him in a game thread because I was worried/emotional about this situation but if Shyatt isn't saying anything it might also be for an edge. If something really bad is going on then he's gonna have to work on it to get back into the program. Shy does give 2nd chances to dudes that earn it.

Nice win for the team. I watched some of the first half and liked what I saw. Missed the fireworks apparently.

We must've played some lock down D and Shyatt probably totally out coached em I'm guessing. I liked what Dalton was doing and everyone has been saying Herndon has been stepping up some aggression. That's great news

Who said Dalton plays looks and plays like a Utah player? That seems pretty damn accurate but since they've kicked our ass with those guys maybe we can get em back with our version. JmcMAN is doing Wyo proud with his play this year, he's the best WYO WYO kid we've had in a long ass time #WYOWYOPRIDE
We have a Wyoming sniper on this team..it's about damn time right? Wyoming high school basketball has a lot of white boy 3 point shooters really, so it's cool to see one of them make it again at UW no less

The sooner Josh Adams no longer leads this team in rebounding the more comfortable I'm gonna be with this season.......but I do appreciate the effort of this high flying Cowboy LEGEND.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:40 am

In some interview in the past on the internet, Marshall SAID he had to work on his defense. Maybe he hasn't arrived yet, but damn it, offense is important too. The next game Marshall gets in, I will be watching him exclusively on defense to form my opinion.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 12:22 pm

Adv8RU12 wrote:In some interview in the past on the internet, Marshall SAID he had to work on his defense. Maybe he hasn't arrived yet, but damn it, offense is important too. The next game Marshall gets in, I will be watching him exclusively on defense to form my opinion.

You can watch the archive of the Ft. Lewis game. He spends a lot of time standing around the free throw line looking for who he's supposed to be guarding while that guys is knocking down open 3's.

In my opinion, I think he'll get the defensive deficiencies cleaned up pretty quickly. He was out for a lot of the pre-season with a concussion - to which Shyatt said that he's way behind in his conditioning. Now, he tweaked an ankle. It's tough to be a well conditioned and sound defensive player when you haven't been able to practice or see the court very much in the last 2 months.

Shyatt will play him when he's ready. He obviously isn't yet. Either he's not right physically yet or he's truly abysmal on the defensive end - because Shyatt has started players in the past that suck on defense. Grabau couldn't guard anyone until his senior year.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 12:55 pm

A few things:

- The defense in the first half was not good. It seemed like we had a really hard time keeping MSU's guards out of the paint and they were doing damage in there. This was more of an issue of footwork and angles more than quickness. It improved considerably in the second half and that's why we pulled away and won comfortably.

- The lineup flexibility we have is crazy right now. We went from ultra-small at times (Lieberman-Washington-Adams-McManamen-Dalton) to big (Adams-McManamen-James-Dalton-Herndon and I'll assume Barnes would have been in on the "big" lineup had he not taken a knock). McManamen is the common denominator - his ability to guard three or four positions is huge. He is sort of the Draymond Green type on this team - he's not the type of passer or playmaker that Draymond is but he can shoot it and he just affords the team so much flexibility due to his ability to guard nearly anyone on the other team. Adams is without question the best and most important player on this team but McManamen is the second most important player and you're kidding yourself if you think otherwise.

- Justin James is the future. When have we ever had a 6'7" wing with athleticism and shooting ability? You could probably argue that Afam Muojeke sort of fit that description but sadly injuries derailed his career. James is a better athlete than Afam and is already an impact player early in his freshman season. Man am I excited to see him grow in this program.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 1:01 pm

In our limited view so far, James reminds me of Marc Bailey with a little more athleticism and about 2 more inches. His offensive game seems similar, and his defense is improving with every game. Let's hope he has the same clutch gene.

During the 2nd half on Saturday, James really showed the ADU. He's buying in, and I can't wait to watch him turn into a star. It's gonna happen sooner than later.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 1:04 pm

wyopig wrote:
Adv8RU12 wrote:In some interview in the past on the internet, Marshall SAID he had to work on his defense. Maybe he hasn't arrived yet, but damn it, offense is important too. The next game Marshall gets in, I will be watching him exclusively on defense to form my opinion.
You can watch the archive of the Ft. Lewis game. He spends a lot of time standing around the free throw line looking for who he's supposed to be guarding while that guys is knocking down open 3's.

In my opinion, I think he'll get the defensive deficiencies cleaned up pretty quickly. He was out for a lot of the pre-season with a concussion - to which Shyatt said that he's way behind in his conditioning. Now, he tweaked an ankle. It's tough to be a well conditioned and sound defensive player when you haven't been able to practice or see the court very much in the last 2 months.

Shyatt will play him when he's ready. He obviously isn't yet. Either he's not right physically yet or he's truly abysmal on the defensive end - because Shyatt has started players in the past that suck on defense. Grabau couldn't guard anyone until his senior year.

Which makes this all the more weird because he really wasn't a scoring threat either...

Mon Nov 30, 2015 1:14 pm

James is the man. He's going to be so good and it was his defense on the perimeter that changed the game just like Cowduck said. He owned Colbert every time he tried to drive. He's quick and long.

Dalton played much better. He's a smart player for sure, but he's a couple years away physically. I wish we could have redshirted him and gotten him a turkey gravy iv to gain weight.

At one point Herndon, James and Dalton were standing in the back court together on a FT. So skinny. Just looking at the three of them made me hungry

Mon Nov 30, 2015 1:15 pm

LanderPoke wrote:James is the man. He's going to be so good and it was his defense on the perimeter that changed the game just like Cowduck said. He owned Colbert every time he tried to drive. He's quick and long.

Dalton played much better. He's a smart player for sure, but he's a couple years away physically. I wish we could have redshirted him and gotten him a turkey gravy iv to gain weight.

At one point Herndon, James and Dalton were standing in the back court together on a FT. So skinny. Just looking at the three of them made me hungry

The way James can play "small" all then turn it on and swat the big dudes is pretty incredible. He's going to be a lot like Adams going forward. It'll be fun to watch him turn into a monster!

Mon Nov 30, 2015 1:16 pm

ItSucksToBeACSURam wrote:
wyopig wrote:
Adv8RU12 wrote:In some interview in the past on the internet, Marshall SAID he had to work on his defense. Maybe he hasn't arrived yet, but damn it, offense is important too. The next game Marshall gets in, I will be watching him exclusively on defense to form my opinion.
You can watch the archive of the Ft. Lewis game. He spends a lot of time standing around the free throw line looking for who he's supposed to be guarding while that guys is knocking down open 3's.

In my opinion, I think he'll get the defensive deficiencies cleaned up pretty quickly. He was out for a lot of the pre-season with a concussion - to which Shyatt said that he's way behind in his conditioning. Now, he tweaked an ankle. It's tough to be a well conditioned and sound defensive player when you haven't been able to practice or see the court very much in the last 2 months.

Shyatt will play him when he's ready. He obviously isn't yet. Either he's not right physically yet or he's truly abysmal on the defensive end - because Shyatt has started players in the past that suck on defense. Grabau couldn't guard anyone until his senior year.
Which makes this all the more weird because he really wasn't a scoring threat either...

Yeah, but he didn't turnover the ball. He led the country in 3-point percentage for more than half the season his junior year, and he made good decisions. He worked hard on defense, but he didn't seem quick enough to guard athletic players. I thought the same thing about McManamen last year, but he looks much better this year. Grabau improved his senior year as well.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 2:41 pm

wyopig wrote:In our limited view so far, James reminds me of Marc Bailey with a little more athleticism and about 2 more inches. His offensive game seems similar, and his defense is improving with every game. Let's hope he has the same clutch gene.

During the 2nd half on Saturday, James really showed the ADU. He's buying in, and I can't wait to watch him turn into a star. It's gonna happen sooner than later.

James will be a better three-point shooter than Bailey was. We remember some huge shots from Bailey's career but he was just an OK three-point shooter - just a shade under 35% for his career. His midrange game was where he really shined. James definitely has elements of that in his game and is a really good "slasher" from the wing like Bailey. I'd say James could be Bailey plus a bit better from behind the arc.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:14 pm

Lieberman still hasn't shown me this season why he deserves time on the floor. At least with other guys in "slumps", they still added something (leadership, energy, etc). I don't see any of that with Lieberman yet.

Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:17 pm

kdwrightuwyo wrote:Lieberman still hasn't shown me this season why he deserves time on the floor. At least with other guys in "slumps", they still added something (leadership, energy, etc). I don't see any of that with Lieberman yet.

I agree. So far, he's turned over the ball, missed shots, and given up baskets. I hope he's just in a slump.