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TSpoke
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LanderPoke wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 6:08 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:29 am
ItSucksToBeACSURam wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:23 am
If only society cared about Heart Disease or Obesity or curing cancer as much as they do for 2020's flavor of the month apocalyptic virus scare....
I mean, we spend a crap ton of money on those already and they also don't spread from person to person, so that's a pretty terrible comparison.

Why worry about the plague when people are dying from traffic accidents?

Are you saying we shouldn't attempt preventing the spread of something that currently has a 3.5% mortality rate? It spreads very similar to the flu, which 30-50 Million people a year get in the United States. Thankfully, the normal flu has a very low mortality rate.

But there's also the secondary concern... 20% of those getting COVID-19 get hospitalized, which means a full-blown spread will kill more Cancer and Heart patients that now won't have access to healthcare.

Once again, I'm not advocating panic. I'm just saying that maybe limiting large conferences and sporting events isn't a dumb idea.
I guarantee that mortality rate is inflated by about a factor of 10
That's a pretty bold guarantee for a virus we know next to nothing about. Why do you blelive this?(well more than believe, know it apparently)

The thing is, if these precautions work we will never know and it will look like an over reaction. This is a serious thing. It isn't the end of the world and we shouldn't be panicking but still take it serious.
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Asmodeanreborn
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Good news everyone!

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WyoBrandX
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Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:28 pm
Good news everyone!

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Fake News...er fun news! Orgy time!
Adv8RU12
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Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:28 pm
Good news everyone!
That explains it! I feel I'm constantly being screwed by everybody, so I don't have it.
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Poke in New England
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Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 9:02 am
Wyokie wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 8:46 pm
And yes it's a jackass fear! I blame the media and the Democrats!!!!!
Lizard-Hillary and the Democrats definitely control the international organization WHO and their thousands of affiliated scientists. Pretty sure the headquarters are on the Moon and not in Switzerland.
The Democrats control Italy also. They shut down their country and over ran their hospitals as part of the big conspiracy
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laxwyo
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Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 8:55 am
laxwyo wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 12:40 am
All you dry wipers freaking out while I’m sitting on a heated seat getting my butthole blasted with warm water. I’ll have a bidet for the rest of my life.
I still find the concept uncomfortable, but everybody I know who has one swears by it. Does it have a water tank that's always heated or something?
There’s a little reservoir of some type because the hot water lasts about 15 seconds. There’s a little remote that controls seat temp, water temp etc. you can even control the angle. You can almost get it to blast your taint but not quite. I turn on “oscillation”, pat and then turn on the heated air blower.
W-Y, Until I Die!
OrediggerPoke
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University of Wyoming moves to online instruction beginning March 30 for remainder of spring semester at a minimum. Students asked to vacate residence halls.

Won’t be any University events (including practice) until May at the earliest. At this time, graduation ceremonies have not been cancelled; but I suspect they will be postponed or in a substantially different format.
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LanderPoke
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I was wondering if graduation would be cancelled.
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Asmodeanreborn
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J-Bone wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:56 am
Just yesterday, Democrats added a bunch of pet projects to the COVID bill, including abortion, guaranteeing it won’t pass. This will all get blamed on Trump.
So, turns out this was something just made up by a couple of conservative news outlets and a few Senators ate it up as if there was no tomorrow. The bill specifically talks about reimbursement to insurers for lab work related to COVID-19. Somebody randomly brought up that maybe there was a way this could be used by abortion, even though no revision of the bill had anything whatsoever to do with abortion services and ONLY covered the reimbursement for testing of COVID-19.

The bill and links to all its revisions can be found here:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-con ... /6201/text

I don't think it's dead yet, though.

I do think people should be very skeptical of anything going on right now in terms of "helping" the economy, however. Look at who the money's going to... is it the small guys who are living pay check to pay check and the family-owned businesses, or is it the huge corporations and banks who already gobble up property of the former every time the economy takes a dive?
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J-Bone
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Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Mon Mar 16, 2020 7:14 pm
J-Bone wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:56 am
Just yesterday, Democrats added a bunch of pet projects to the COVID bill, including abortion, guaranteeing it won’t pass. This will all get blamed on Trump.
So, turns out this was something just made up by a couple of conservative news outlets and a few Senators ate it up as if there was no tomorrow. The bill specifically talks about reimbursement to insurers for lab work related to COVID-19. Somebody randomly brought up that maybe there was a way this could be used by abortion, even though no revision of the bill had anything whatsoever to do with abortion services and ONLY covered the reimbursement for testing of COVID-19.

The bill and links to all its revisions can be found here:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-con ... /6201/text

I don't think it's dead yet, though.

I do think people should be very skeptical of anything going on right now in terms of "helping" the economy, however. Look at who the money's going to... is it the small guys who are living pay check to pay check and the family-owned businesses, or is it the huge corporations and banks who already gobble up property of the former every time the economy takes a dive?
Thanks for sharing. The thing is, we don't know exactly what was in the original bill. Even MSNBC was reporting that it included abortion funding, so it wasn't just a right wing conspiracy. It's good to see Congress actually progressing on this, though.

My position remains the same. I can barely turn on the TV or radio without hearing "Orange Man Bad" regarding COVID-19. I don't know what the right solution is, but the US is objectively in a better position than a lot of other areas of the world regarding the virus.

On a similar note, I just read that the worldwide death toll is up to 7,500, with the US at 85 today. Over half the deaths are in Washington state. California has the second most deaths at six.
ragtimejoe1
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Politics surrounding this is ridiculous. We didn't get ahead of this and it's not anyone's fault.

Right now, testing centers need to be opened and no citizenship status considered. The illegal/undocumented population is a gaping hole in our defense against the virus. Testing is the only way out and we have to test as many people as possible.

Looks like some areas are going to get rough.
"There's always excuses for a sports program not winning or academic program not succeeding. And it's not that the excuses aren't true; it's that they aren't sufficient," --Sternberg
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Asmodeanreborn
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ragtimejoe1 wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 11:42 am
Politics surrounding this is ridiculous. We didn't get ahead of this and it's not anyone's fault.
I mean, that's just plain wrong. There was plenty of opportunity to get ahead of this, and there was a large number of experts right away saying we needed to test people coming in from China and Italy. The response? "It's a Democratic hoax." This went on for several weeks before the tune finally changed.

The President trying to pass the buck to Bolton for firing the Pandemic Response Team a couple of years ago was pretty pathetic as well. "I had no idea about it" isn't a lie that works all that great when there's video of you talking about it.

On top of that, in 2018 the funding for the CDC’s global disease outbreak prevention efforts werereduced by 80%, including funding for the agency’s efforts in China.



Seriously, this is not normal. This is not competent. Thankfully, there are plenty of people around still doing the right thing, or this could be far worse than it is... and to Trump's credit, at least he's not one of the salt gargling conspiracy theorists.
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fromolwyoming
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Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 1:24 pm
ragtimejoe1 wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 11:42 am
Politics surrounding this is ridiculous. We didn't get ahead of this and it's not anyone's fault.
I mean, that's just plain wrong. There was plenty of opportunity to get ahead of this, and there was a large number of experts right away saying we needed to test people coming in from China and Italy. The response? "It's a Democratic hoax." This went on for several weeks before the tune finally changed.

The President trying to pass the buck to Bolton for firing the Pandemic Response Team a couple of years ago was pretty pathetic as well. "I had no idea about it" isn't a lie that works all that great when there's video of you talking about it.

On top of that, in 2018 the funding for the CDC’s global disease outbreak prevention efforts werereduced by 80%, including funding for the agency’s efforts in China.



Seriously, this is not normal. This is not competent. Thankfully, there are plenty of people around still doing the right thing, or this could be far worse than it is... and to Trump's credit, at least he's not one of the salt gargling conspiracy theorists.
Agreed. It may not be comfortable to make it political, but that was done when the Pandemic Response Team was fired for being created by the previous administration. And can't forget that it was outright dismissed for weeks on end, only being acknowledged when it started to show in the stock markets and the number of infected in the US kept ballooning because no screening was done at the beginning of all of this to head it off.
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LanderPoke
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Whatever our response, it was light years better than Canada's
Last edited by LanderPoke on Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ragtimejoe1
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Meh. Nature vs. Govt? Give me nature every time. Some things are simply beyond control. Complete lockdown 3 weeks ago and must test negative to get out of lockdown would work but not practical. Could response be better? Who cares. Just gotta deal with what we have to deal with and it won't be easy. Once fixed, then, by all means, let the partisan hacks resume. Until fixed, the last thing we need are the partisan hacks.

Every country has their unique logistical challenges.
"There's always excuses for a sports program not winning or academic program not succeeding. And it's not that the excuses aren't true; it's that they aren't sufficient," --Sternberg
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'PokeForLife
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TSpoke wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:19 pm
LanderPoke wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 6:08 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:29 am
ItSucksToBeACSURam wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:23 am
If only society cared about Heart Disease or Obesity or curing cancer as much as they do for 2020's flavor of the month apocalyptic virus scare....
I mean, we spend a crap ton of money on those already and they also don't spread from person to person, so that's a pretty terrible comparison.

Why worry about the plague when people are dying from traffic accidents?

Are you saying we shouldn't attempt preventing the spread of something that currently has a 3.5% mortality rate? It spreads very similar to the flu, which 30-50 Million people a year get in the United States. Thankfully, the normal flu has a very low mortality rate.

But there's also the secondary concern... 20% of those getting COVID-19 get hospitalized, which means a full-blown spread will kill more Cancer and Heart patients that now won't have access to healthcare.

Once again, I'm not advocating panic. I'm just saying that maybe limiting large conferences and sporting events isn't a dumb idea.
I guarantee that mortality rate is inflated by about a factor of 10
That's a pretty bold guarantee for a virus we know next to nothing about. Why do you blelive this?(well more than believe, know it apparently)

The thing is, if these precautions work we will never know and it will look like an over reaction. This is a serious thing. It isn't the end of the world and we shouldn't be panicking but still take it serious.
1. Yes, we should certainly take this seriously. It is more serious than anyone thought it would be. Its a good thing the flu doesn't overwhelm the system every year like this has.
2. The death rate is not 3.5% (I know it was a while ago that you wrote this, now things are lower) -- but at any rate, this is just of confirmed cases. Epidemiologists feel that there likely were thousands of unknown cases in the US before any of the confirmed cases popped up in Washington. We have not been testing people and have no idea how many people have had it. In fact, the policy of the UCHealth system right now is to counsel families to stay home if they have any cold-like symptoms and only come to the clinic or the emergency room if there is a high fever or significant shortness of breath. If you don't need oxygen when you walk in the door, you will be sent home until you do. All we know is that we are aware of the serious cases.

An abstract for an article set to be released in the journal Emerging Infectious Diseases says:
"Abstract
We estimated the case-fatality risk for 2019 novel coronavirus disease cases in China (3.5%); China, excluding Hubei Province (0.8%); 82 countries, territories, and areas (4.2%); and on a cruise ship (0.6%). Lower estimates might be closest to the true value, but a broad range of 0.25%–3.0% probably should be considered."
They still don't know yet because we don't know who's had it. What will push the fatality rate up, however, is if our system gets pushed much further past its capacity to care for serious cases.
TSpoke
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'PokeForLife wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:57 pm
TSpoke wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:19 pm
LanderPoke wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 6:08 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:29 am
ItSucksToBeACSURam wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:23 am
If only society cared about Heart Disease or Obesity or curing cancer as much as they do for 2020's flavor of the month apocalyptic virus scare....
I mean, we spend a crap ton of money on those already and they also don't spread from person to person, so that's a pretty terrible comparison.

Why worry about the plague when people are dying from traffic accidents?

Are you saying we shouldn't attempt preventing the spread of something that currently has a 3.5% mortality rate? It spreads very similar to the flu, which 30-50 Million people a year get in the United States. Thankfully, the normal flu has a very low mortality rate.

But there's also the secondary concern... 20% of those getting COVID-19 get hospitalized, which means a full-blown spread will kill more Cancer and Heart patients that now won't have access to healthcare.

Once again, I'm not advocating panic. I'm just saying that maybe limiting large conferences and sporting events isn't a dumb idea.
I guarantee that mortality rate is inflated by about a factor of 10
That's a pretty bold guarantee for a virus we know next to nothing about. Why do you blelive this?(well more than believe, know it apparently)

The thing is, if these precautions work we will never know and it will look like an over reaction. This is a serious thing. It isn't the end of the world and we shouldn't be panicking but still take it serious.
1. Yes, we should certainly take this seriously. It is more serious than anyone thought it would be. Its a good thing the flu doesn't overwhelm the system every year like this has.
2. The death rate is not 3.5% (I know it was a while ago that you wrote this, now things are lower) -- but at any rate, this is just of confirmed cases. Epidemiologists feel that there likely were thousands of unknown cases in the US before any of the confirmed cases popped up in Washington. We have not been testing people and have no idea how many people have had it. In fact, the policy of the UCHealth system right now is to counsel families to stay home if they have any cold-like symptoms and only come to the clinic or the emergency room if there is a high fever or significant shortness of breath. If you don't need oxygen when you walk in the door, you will be sent home until you do. All we know is that we are aware of the serious cases.

An abstract for an article set to be released in the journal Emerging Infectious Diseases says:
"Abstract
We estimated the case-fatality risk for 2019 novel coronavirus disease cases in China (3.5%); China, excluding Hubei Province (0.8%); 82 countries, territories, and areas (4.2%); and on a cruise ship (0.6%). Lower estimates might be closest to the true value, but a broad range of 0.25%–3.0% probably should be considered."
They still don't know yet because we don't know who's had it. What will push the fatality rate up, however, is if our system gets pushed much further past its capacity to care for serious cases.
Yes there are probably lots of people that have it that aren't recorded but there are also people out there that have died from it that didn't go into that stat as well. THey are listed to have died from pneumonia or something else before we started keeping a close look at these things. Your right the death rate most likely isn't 3.5% but even your very low range of .25% is two and a half times that of the flu. It looks like Korea which has had a pretty extensive testing program where they know a lot more about it has a mortality rate around 1% but again they have hada very good testing program which has lead to a very good reponse to it so ours could be higher than that since we haven't been testing like they have. But I think 1% is a pretty reasonable number. which is still 10x higher than the flu.
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'PokeForLife
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TSpoke wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:06 am
'PokeForLife wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:57 pm
TSpoke wrote:
Fri Mar 13, 2020 3:19 pm
LanderPoke wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 6:08 pm
Asmodeanreborn wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:29 am
ItSucksToBeACSURam wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:23 am
If only society cared about Heart Disease or Obesity or curing cancer as much as they do for 2020's flavor of the month apocalyptic virus scare....
I mean, we spend a crap ton of money on those already and they also don't spread from person to person, so that's a pretty terrible comparison.

Why worry about the plague when people are dying from traffic accidents?

Are you saying we shouldn't attempt preventing the spread of something that currently has a 3.5% mortality rate? It spreads very similar to the flu, which 30-50 Million people a year get in the United States. Thankfully, the normal flu has a very low mortality rate.

But there's also the secondary concern... 20% of those getting COVID-19 get hospitalized, which means a full-blown spread will kill more Cancer and Heart patients that now won't have access to healthcare.

Once again, I'm not advocating panic. I'm just saying that maybe limiting large conferences and sporting events isn't a dumb idea.
I guarantee that mortality rate is inflated by about a factor of 10
That's a pretty bold guarantee for a virus we know next to nothing about. Why do you blelive this?(well more than believe, know it apparently)

The thing is, if these precautions work we will never know and it will look like an over reaction. This is a serious thing. It isn't the end of the world and we shouldn't be panicking but still take it serious.
1. Yes, we should certainly take this seriously. It is more serious than anyone thought it would be. Its a good thing the flu doesn't overwhelm the system every year like this has.
2. The death rate is not 3.5% (I know it was a while ago that you wrote this, now things are lower) -- but at any rate, this is just of confirmed cases. Epidemiologists feel that there likely were thousands of unknown cases in the US before any of the confirmed cases popped up in Washington. We have not been testing people and have no idea how many people have had it. In fact, the policy of the UCHealth system right now is to counsel families to stay home if they have any cold-like symptoms and only come to the clinic or the emergency room if there is a high fever or significant shortness of breath. If you don't need oxygen when you walk in the door, you will be sent home until you do. All we know is that we are aware of the serious cases.

An abstract for an article set to be released in the journal Emerging Infectious Diseases says:
"Abstract
We estimated the case-fatality risk for 2019 novel coronavirus disease cases in China (3.5%); China, excluding Hubei Province (0.8%); 82 countries, territories, and areas (4.2%); and on a cruise ship (0.6%). Lower estimates might be closest to the true value, but a broad range of 0.25%–3.0% probably should be considered."
They still don't know yet because we don't know who's had it. What will push the fatality rate up, however, is if our system gets pushed much further past its capacity to care for serious cases.
Yes there are probably lots of people that have it that aren't recorded but there are also people out there that have died from it that didn't go into that stat as well. THey are listed to have died from pneumonia or something else before we started keeping a close look at these things. Your right the death rate most likely isn't 3.5% but even your very low range of .25% is two and a half times that of the flu. It looks like Korea which has had a pretty extensive testing program where they know a lot more about it has a mortality rate around 1% but again they have hada very good testing program which has lead to a very good reponse to it so ours could be higher than that since we haven't been testing like they have. But I think 1% is a pretty reasonable number. which is still 10x higher than the flu.
Yes, hence my first point and the reasoning for hospital policies like UCHealth's. .25% is worse than flu, so lets hope the system doesn't get overrun much more than it is.

And there were likely some deaths we didn't know about that went down as simply viral pneumonia, but the fact remains that we still are not testing people who aren't bad, and now everybody that is serious enough for hospitalization is tested. The unknown cases who die stopped as soon as (or quickly thereafter) the outbreak hit America. The .25% isn't my number. Its real infectious disease epidemiologists' who actually know what they are talking about.
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Asmodeanreborn
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'PokeForLife wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:58 am
Yes, hence my first point and the reasoning for hospital policies like UCHealth's. .25% is worse than flu, so lets hope the system doesn't get overrun much more than it is.

And there were likely some deaths we didn't know about that went down as simply viral pneumonia, but the fact remains that we still are not testing people who aren't bad, and now everybody that is serious enough for hospitalization is tested. The unknown cases who die stopped as soon as (or quickly thereafter) the outbreak hit America. The .25% isn't my number. Its real infectious disease epidemiologists' who actually know what they are talking about.
I do think (and hope) you're right about this. Very few with little to no symptoms got tested in other places even though they likely had the virus, and those won't go into the mortality rate calculation, because there's really no way to know about them.

It's also been almost impossible to get tested here even with more severe symptoms. My co-worker and his wife have been knocked out for close to two weeks now and when they tried to get tested, they were asked
1) Have you recently been abroad?
and
2) Do you know if you have recently interacted with a person who tested positive?

Since they answered no to both of those questions and did not need to get hospitalized, they couldn't get the doctor's recommendation needed for the testing available in Denver.

Does this mean they have the virus? Definitely not. They just have the symptoms, which could also be the regular flu with dry coughing added on.
carbonpoke
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Location: Puyallup, WA

Just a lifestyle update from Washington.

My wife and I decided to alternate days off to watch my son. She can telework, but has to go into her office periodically to do hands on administrative stuff. We kinda stocked up on groceries, but probably not enough for long term.

My job has me busy enough, people need gas, worked a twelve hour day yesterday. Only a few days into this and my family is already stir crazy. On Joint Base Lewis McCord police are checking people for a temperature before they are allowed into businesses or offices.

The virus is still spreading at it's extravagant pace. Some restaurants, only a few, are offering delivery or curbside service. Most others are closed. Most government supporting services are closed, i.e no background checks, no vehicle licensing. Hundreds of thousands of workers are not working, most unemployed. Governor just threw 200 million to support unemployment.

And Russell Wilson just donated a million meals for kids in Seattle, that's pretty cool
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