OT: Could 2020 just end now!!!!!!

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bladerunnr
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WestWYOPoke wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:50 pm
ZapPoke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:32 pm
Expat_Poke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:42 am
WestWYOPoke wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:54 pm
First off, the one incident comment was brought up because you literally said "To take one incident and make it indicative of the nation at large is questionable, at best."

To the second part of your comment, no, not all white people are racist, but yes this absolutely is a racist nation, has been basically since it was founded. Want proof, turn on the tv.
[/url]
Thanks Expat, this is one of the best posts I have seen in this thread. I need someone to define “systemic racism”. I just don’t see it. Houston is one of the most racially diverse cities in the country. We didn’t experience the severe rioting other large cities did. Perhaps that is why I don’t see the racism because we just don’t have it. Back in the 60’s even Houston didn’t have the race issues of other places. One day some black students from TSU went into a “whites only” lunch counter. They didn’t raise a ruckus, they just sat there. The business leaders got together and that night all the “whites only” signs disappeared. And it was over. That is why we respect MLK. he accomplished what he did without violence or riots.

To sum up, would someone please provide a definition and evidence of systemic racism?
I'm sure you've heard the talking point about black-on-black crime...this talking point is evidence of systemic racism, but why you might ask?

Well, to summarize:

It is true, if you look at just numbers based on race, their is much higher black-on-black crime in this country than other demographics, BUT that is the wrong mitigating factor.

The true mitigating factor is socioeconomic status (SES). When factoring for SES, we find that crime among all demographics is almost equal. In fact, white-on-white crime might actually be higher than black-on-black when SES is neutralized.

So why then, do we have high numbers of black-on-black crime in this country? It is because the black community is disproportionately in a lower SES bracket than their counter parts. Which leads us to the question of why that is? There's only really 2 options to consider: A) people of color are "lazier" or naturally less able than others (an obvious racist statement), or B) our very system is setup to discriminate against people of color.

Since I would like to think no one on this board, and very few people in this country think the answer is actually option A, then we are likely looking at option B for the actual reasoning.

I'm sure there are other examples as well, but this is one of this most simplistic to discuss and understand.

TLDR: race doesn't affect crime, SES status does, black community is disproportionately Low SES, they are low SES because of systemic racism.
This is pure nonsense, of course. 75 percent of all African American children are in single parent households. Those households are predominantly headed by non college educated females with limited job skills. This is a prime example of looking at the results and then, with the pre disposed notion that America is a racist nation, pinning the cause on all the white racists. No one forced those women to give birth out of wedlock. In fact, abortions are a readily available and free option through planned parenthood. The economic and social benefits of a 2 parent household are statistically overwhelming. White kids born into the same poor single parent situation suffer the same fates as black kids. But when you use a vague term like "systemic racism", then you don't have to define your terms. The fact is: This country has had numerous and far reaching affirmative action programs to benefit African Americans for the last 50 years. I can tell you in my days in public accounting, if you were an African American, you were a "shoe in" in my firm. Numerous public and private industries were/are required to hire a percentage or number of black applicants. It's just amazing to me that people hate American govt and or history to the extent that they irrationally blame all of society's ills on it.
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WestWYOPoke
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bladerunnr wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:20 pm
WestWYOPoke wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:50 pm
ZapPoke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:32 pm
Expat_Poke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:42 am
WestWYOPoke wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:54 pm
First off, the one incident comment was brought up because you literally said "To take one incident and make it indicative of the nation at large is questionable, at best."

To the second part of your comment, no, not all white people are racist, but yes this absolutely is a racist nation, has been basically since it was founded. Want proof, turn on the tv.
[/url]
Thanks Expat, this is one of the best posts I have seen in this thread. I need someone to define “systemic racism”. I just don’t see it. Houston is one of the most racially diverse cities in the country. We didn’t experience the severe rioting other large cities did. Perhaps that is why I don’t see the racism because we just don’t have it. Back in the 60’s even Houston didn’t have the race issues of other places. One day some black students from TSU went into a “whites only” lunch counter. They didn’t raise a ruckus, they just sat there. The business leaders got together and that night all the “whites only” signs disappeared. And it was over. That is why we respect MLK. he accomplished what he did without violence or riots.

To sum up, would someone please provide a definition and evidence of systemic racism?
I'm sure you've heard the talking point about black-on-black crime...this talking point is evidence of systemic racism, but why you might ask?

Well, to summarize:

It is true, if you look at just numbers based on race, their is much higher black-on-black crime in this country than other demographics, BUT that is the wrong mitigating factor.

The true mitigating factor is socioeconomic status (SES). When factoring for SES, we find that crime among all demographics is almost equal. In fact, white-on-white crime might actually be higher than black-on-black when SES is neutralized.

So why then, do we have high numbers of black-on-black crime in this country? It is because the black community is disproportionately in a lower SES bracket than their counter parts. Which leads us to the question of why that is? There's only really 2 options to consider: A) people of color are "lazier" or naturally less able than others (an obvious racist statement), or B) our very system is setup to discriminate against people of color.

Since I would like to think no one on this board, and very few people in this country think the answer is actually option A, then we are likely looking at option B for the actual reasoning.

I'm sure there are other examples as well, but this is one of this most simplistic to discuss and understand.

TLDR: race doesn't affect crime, SES status does, black community is disproportionately Low SES, they are low SES because of systemic racism.
This is pure nonsense, of course. 75 percent of all African American children are in single parent households. Those households are predominantly headed by non college educated females with limited job skills. This is a prime example of looking at the results and then, with the pre disposed notion that America is a racist nation, pinning the cause on all the white racists. No one forced those women to give birth out of wedlock. In fact, abortions are a readily available and free option through planned parenthood. The economic and social benefits of a 2 parent household are statistically overwhelming. White kids born into the same poor single parent situation suffer the same fates as black kids. But when you use a vague term like "systemic racism", then you don't have to define your terms. The fact is: This country has had numerous and far reaching affirmative action programs to benefit African Americans for the last 50 years. I can tell you in my days in public accounting, if you were an African American, you were a "shoe in" in my firm. Numerous public and private industries were/are required to hire a percentage or number of black applicants. It's just amazing to me that people hate American govt and or history to the extent that they irrationally blame all of society's ills on it.
First off, your statistic is misleading. About 72% of black children are born out of wedlock, closer to 65% live with 1 parent. Still very high I agree but that doesn't mean they only have 1 active parent, that percent would be lower than 65%.

But for arguments sake, let's say you are correct with your statement. Then why is this happening? Why is the single parent statistic so much higher in the AA population? Why is affirmative action a thing? What is the cause?
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Asmodeanreborn
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ragtimejoe1 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:44 am
I wasn't aware of any states allowing mass gatherings of hundreds or thousands of people? Perhaps you can point me in that direction. If the march in Casper today exceeds 250 people, will the governor intervene? Will the march be shut down? We'll see, but I doubt it. If over 250 people congregate in Casper, how is that ok but not at a local fair, rodeo, or church?

Is NY allowing church services with thousands of attendees? MN? DC? St. Louis.

How is it remotely legal to enforce social distancing and crowd restrictions going forward?

Sorry, this is a really late response. I think generally protest guidelines state that you should stay six feet apart without masks (and wear a mask if that can't be maintained), and group sizes with mask have different guidelines depending on state. Outdoors it seems fine to have infinitely large groups if you can keep apart in many states. Obviously, people haven't been following that, and I'm sure we're going to see an explosion in new COVID cases in many of those locations as a result. Colorado's already approaching 1+ for the reprod number again despite all the current precautions, so that's unfortunate. Oh well...

Colorado also just released guidelines for sports, and that's up to 25 people for outdoor sports (like baseball) with spectators discouraged. Umps/refs and coaches don't count as part of that restriction. My son's baseball starts next week, and we'll finally be able to ice skate again too. I definitely think it's the right move to open things up in phases, whereas a place like NYC would probably be better off waiting a bit longer.

As for your question about church - I've mentioned it before, but my father-in-law is a pastor so I'm sort of hooked into the greater church family through him, and it looks like a lot of his fellow pastors in large congregations are doing outdoor services when they can. I've seen several with hundreds of people spaced roughly six feet apart, and the worship team being separated by plexiglass from each other and from the rest of the people in the congregation. Seems like a decent enough solution when possible... obviously many elderly/vulnerable are staying away from being there in person, which is also probably the right move for now.
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Asmodeanreborn
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Not sure if you saw, but Utah has also suspended one of their coaches for using a slur... in 2013. Maybe a bit of a late reaction, but it also just came out, and it's "just" a suspension for now, so whatever...

Not surprisingly, there's a BYU fan in the comments calling Utah cowards for the suspension?
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WestWYOPoke wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:24 pm
bladerunnr wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:20 pm
WestWYOPoke wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:50 pm
ZapPoke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:32 pm
Expat_Poke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:42 am
WestWYOPoke wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 5:54 pm
First off, the one incident comment was brought up because you literally said "To take one incident and make it indicative of the nation at large is questionable, at best."

To the second part of your comment, no, not all white people are racist, but yes this absolutely is a racist nation, has been basically since it was founded. Want proof, turn on the tv.
[/url]
Thanks Expat, this is one of the best posts I have seen in this thread. I need someone to define “systemic racism”. I just don’t see it. Houston is one of the most racially diverse cities in the country. We didn’t experience the severe rioting other large cities did. Perhaps that is why I don’t see the racism because we just don’t have it. Back in the 60’s even Houston didn’t have the race issues of other places. One day some black students from TSU went into a “whites only” lunch counter. They didn’t raise a ruckus, they just sat there. The business leaders got together and that night all the “whites only” signs disappeared. And it was over. That is why we respect MLK. he accomplished what he did without violence or riots.

To sum up, would someone please provide a definition and evidence of systemic racism?
I'm sure you've heard the talking point about black-on-black crime...this talking point is evidence of systemic racism, but why you might ask?

Well, to summarize:

It is true, if you look at just numbers based on race, their is much higher black-on-black crime in this country than other demographics, BUT that is the wrong mitigating factor.

The true mitigating factor is socioeconomic status (SES). When factoring for SES, we find that crime among all demographics is almost equal. In fact, white-on-white crime might actually be higher than black-on-black when SES is neutralized.

So why then, do we have high numbers of black-on-black crime in this country? It is because the black community is disproportionately in a lower SES bracket than their counter parts. Which leads us to the question of why that is? There's only really 2 options to consider: A) people of color are "lazier" or naturally less able than others (an obvious racist statement), or B) our very system is setup to discriminate against people of color.

Since I would like to think no one on this board, and very few people in this country think the answer is actually option A, then we are likely looking at option B for the actual reasoning.

I'm sure there are other examples as well, but this is one of this most simplistic to discuss and understand.

TLDR: race doesn't affect crime, SES status does, black community is disproportionately Low SES, they are low SES because of systemic racism.
This is pure nonsense, of course. 75 percent of all African American children are in single parent households. Those households are predominantly headed by non college educated females with limited job skills. This is a prime example of looking at the results and then, with the pre disposed notion that America is a racist nation, pinning the cause on all the white racists. No one forced those women to give birth out of wedlock. In fact, abortions are a readily available and free option through planned parenthood. The economic and social benefits of a 2 parent household are statistically overwhelming. White kids born into the same poor single parent situation suffer the same fates as black kids. But when you use a vague term like "systemic racism", then you don't have to define your terms. The fact is: This country has had numerous and far reaching affirmative action programs to benefit African Americans for the last 50 years. I can tell you in my days in public accounting, if you were an African American, you were a "shoe in" in my firm. Numerous public and private industries were/are required to hire a percentage or number of black applicants. It's just amazing to me that people hate American govt and or history to the extent that they irrationally blame all of society's ills on it.
First off, your statistic is misleading. About 72% of black children are born out of wedlock, closer to 65% live with 1 parent. Still very high I agree but that doesn't mean they only have 1 active parent, that percent would be lower than 65%.

But for arguments sake, let's say you are correct with your statement. Then why is this happening? Why is the single parent statistic so much higher in the AA population? Why is affirmative action a thing? What is the cause?
Systemic racism must be what keeps white dudes from being represented proportionally in the NBA then.
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WyoBrandX
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Asmodeanreborn wrote: Sun May 31, 2020 8:38 pm
bladerunnr wrote: Sun May 31, 2020 6:16 pm Please tell me one instance where "riots" led to change for the better? I didn't realize that destroying personal property and looting are good things. You have some moronic views. People who want to go out in public without a mask are like drunk drivers. Yet, thugs setting cars and buildings ablaze are agents of positive change.
The Boston Tea Party is probably the first and most important one.

I'm not claiming riots are positive, nor am I supporting them. I'm claiming that sometimes they do lead to positive change, no matter how much they also ruin.


I'd normally bite on your other stuff too, but there's really no point to it. People not knowing how to control their emotions is a huge part of this mess to begin with, so I suppose I can at least try myself?
I don't think controlling emotions are part of it anymore. There are some serious racist problems in this country. It probably wouldn't be nearly as bad as it is now if we hadn't militarized our police force in the 90's, and started sending minorities to prison in the '80's.

Think about it this way - if you started seeing a few cowboy fans killed by the cops every year, pulled over hundreds of thousands of times for poop reasons, you might start to revolt. The looting and rioting is not a good thing, but I can understand the protests. Everyone says "Law Law Law - obey the law." Then you do, get pulled over and choked to death. That aint right. Think about if you didn't do anything wrong - other than maybe running a stop sign - and a cop gave you the death penalty?

I bet ol' Floyd - looking at the size of the guy, could have probably got the cop off his back - and ended up shot instead. There was no win in that situation for him. He just had to deal with the cards that were handed to him.
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LanderPoke wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:46 am crazy that some people are defending the violence and looting. Asinine. Everyone that can be ID'd doing a crime better be prosecuted.
As they should be. Most of them are protesting getting sent to jail, getting killed, or other things just because someone doesn't think much of them.

Looters and rioters are taking advantage of the situation (hell maybe they should - they probably are unemployed right now). Regardless, until this country starts treating everyone equally and fairly, we are going to continue seeing this. This is why the colonies broke from the king back in 1776.

I like to point out that my great great great grandad and his brother fought against each other in the civil war. It doesn't matter though. We left millions without any opportunity to better themselves at that time. Or past that time - or perhaps beyond today.

I grew up in a poor poor white family. I didn't have a land line rotary phone often times in the late- 70's to mid early 80s' or whatever. I busted out of that and have been successful, and have brought parts of my family up with me as a result. It is differeent for the protesters. It is different for the looters and rioters.

Its a tough world, - and I believe this country does provide alot of opportunities to people that didn't have them in the past. And I think that is great. Some people are more motivated than others.

At the end of the day, families just need a bit of land they can call home, do what they want, not pay out the ass in taxes, and get smarter doing so. Unfortunately, we have denied alot of people these options.

If you want equality, fairness, and all that, I think there are a few things that we can do - and they go far beyond the current affairs:

1.) All reservations should be able to have 2 senators - and at least 1 representative in the house. Give the indegenious persons more of a voice in government.

2.) For every elected seat in the senate and house, there should be an opposite the deed available. Eg Wyoming should have 2 female senators, 2 male senators, 1 female rep, and 1 male rep.

And we need to focus on getting everyone on an equal playing field.
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ragtimejoe1 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:44 am
I wasn't aware of any states allowing mass gatherings of hundreds or thousands of people? Perhaps you can point me in that direction. If the march in Casper today exceeds 250 people, will the governor intervene? Will the march be shut down? We'll see, but I doubt it. If over 250 people congregate in Casper, how is that ok but not at a local fair, rodeo, or church?

How is it remotely legal to enforce social distancing and crowd restrictions going forward?
Perhaps they covered their mouths and stayed six feet apart? My wife asked me the other day about the protests in casper. She said - everyone laying on Wyoming Blvd in Casper is a bunch of idiots. I told her she was right. However, there is a big difference. Those protestors had a first amendment right to be there. Nobody has a right to drive. Its a privilege granted to you via a license.

The protestors have more of a right to be there and tell us what they want than we have to drive on the same road. Let that sink in for a moment.

We need to do better. We need to improve all human rights. WE need to demiltorize our police departments (it was never necessary in the first place.) And for god sakes, most of us need to quit listening to the goddamn propaganda.
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ragtimejoe1 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:25 pm
OrediggerPoke wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:27 pm
ragtimejoe1 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:13 pm Let's just use 1 case study but can be applied nationally:

Right now in NY the restrictions are:
Gatherings of 10 or Fewer
Any gatherings of no more than 10 people will be allowed statewide beginning Friday, May 22nd.
Religious gatherings of no more than 10 people and drive-in and parking lot services will be allowed statewide beginning Thursday, May 21st.
You must still keep at least 6 feet of distance between yourself and others and wear a mask or a face covering when social distancing is not possible. Social distancing guidelines and cleaning and disinfection guidelines required by the Department of Health must be followed.
https://portal.311.nyc.gov/article/?kanumber=KA-03299

How can NY possibly punish churchgoers who violate this order? How can NY possibly fine or punish anyone for not following guidelines who violates this order when NY turns a blind eye to "peaceful" protesters who clearly and indisputably violate this order? Lawsuits are coming, guaranteed.

The riots may indirectly end COVID social distancing regulations.
You're right. Even if a law as written were to be found constitutional (which quite a few public health orders don't appear to be), if the law isn't being applied uniformly then the law itself can be struck down for its enforcement violating the equal protection clause.
Case Study #2.

https://trib.com/news/local/casper/hund ... 88f53.html
Yep- and how many of them have seen people they identify with die. Most of it being over skin color. They deserve to be able to march out and express their opinions. You can do it too. Luckily, your probably pretty secure right now. Next time you start feeling like your under appreciated - start thinking about how many people around you are dying. Being treated like poop.


I don't care anymore TBH. I want everyone to be treated equally. I think that is what our constituion provides in the first few words. Yet - there was another 100 years of enslaving people after that. And its over skin color, which i think has 3 markers out of 4 billion on our dna. Its nothing.

Yet we fight. Heres a question for you? When did Wyoming do something in support of our motto? Equality state?
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@WyoBrandX

Horse crap. COVID restrictions are for everyone but protesters. Either COVID restrictions are necessary and should be enforced or not.

Look at the pictures. The protests are not following guidelines yet governors, media, etc are supporting them.

Pandemics don't work like that. You either have a pandemic that requires measures enforced EQUALLY or you do not. It is cut and dry science. Virus doesn't give a damn about societal issues. It's either a pandemic or it's not.

Let the protesters protest but give the exact same non enforcement of COVID restrictions to everything else. End all COVID restrictions other than "suggesting" 6' spacing and wearing a mask. End all mandates. Period.

Allowing the protests is putting millions at risk depriving their right to live OR the restrictions are unnecessary and should be criminal for crashing the economy, financially devastating millions, etc.

There simply is no grey area here. It is or it isn't.
WYO1016 wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 8:10 am I'm starting to think that Burman has been laying the pipe to ragtimejoe1's wife
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WyoBrandX wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:17 pm
ragtimejoe1 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:44 am
I wasn't aware of any states allowing mass gatherings of hundreds or thousands of people? Perhaps you can point me in that direction. If the march in Casper today exceeds 250 people, will the governor intervene? Will the march be shut down? We'll see, but I doubt it. If over 250 people congregate in Casper, how is that ok but not at a local fair, rodeo, or church?

How is it remotely legal to enforce social distancing and crowd restrictions going forward?
Perhaps they covered their mouths and stayed six feet apart? My wife asked me the other day about the protests in casper. She said - everyone laying on Wyoming Blvd in Casper is a bunch of idiots. I told her she was right. However, there is a big difference. Those protestors had a first amendment right to be there. Nobody has a right to drive. Its a privilege granted to you via a license.

The protestors have more of a right to be there and tell us what they want than we have to drive on the same road. Let that sink in for a moment.

We need to do better. We need to improve all human rights. WE need to demiltorize our police departments (it was never necessary in the first place.) And for god sakes, most of us need to quit listening to the goddamn propaganda.
The biggest load of poop I've ever read. People have a first amendment right to protest. They do not have a right to block public access to roads and buildings. It is illegal in most, if not all, jurisdictions to do so. I pray that you did not go to UW, because your knowledge of basic law is moronic.
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WyoBrandX wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:03 pm If you want equality, fairness, and all that, I think there are a few things that we can do - and they go far beyond the current affairs:

1.) All reservations should be able to have 2 senators - and at least 1 representative in the house. Give the indegenious persons more of a voice in government.

2.) For every elected seat in the senate and house, there should be an opposite the deed available. Eg Wyoming should have 2 female senators, 2 male senators, 1 female rep, and 1 male rep.

And we need to focus on getting everyone on an equal playing field.
I agree. I also would add TERM LIMITS for anyone elected!!!!!! Problem with you idea, WyoBrandX, is that we'd have to build a much larger Congress building to house both sides whenever they meet to vote and stuff..

I got a couple of friends on Facebook who acting as of this is the beginning of the end i.e., the religious apocalypse, which drives me nuts since I'm atheist!!!!! And I got other friends who are going full on tinfold hat conspiracy theorist mode!!!!!! :roll: It feels like I'm the last sane person on the planet!!!!!
I want CHAMPIONSHIPS not chicken poop! And we're getting chicken poop!!!!!!!!!!!
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WyoBrandX, here’s some light reading. Start thinking objectively instead of emotionally

https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/publi ... -use-force#

Don’t trust anyone who screams racism. We’re literally living in the safest and least racist time in the history of civilization. Does racism exist? Sure. I’d argue it’s not coming from white folks. Does policing need reformed? You bet.
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WyoBrandX
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ragtimejoe1 wrote: Sat Jun 06, 2020 7:04 am @WyoBrandX

Horse crap. COVID restrictions are for everyone but protesters. Either COVID restrictions are necessary and should be enforced or not.

Look at the pictures. The protests are not following guidelines yet governors, media, etc are supporting them.

Pandemics don't work like that. You either have a pandemic that requires measures enforced EQUALLY or you do not. It is cut and dry science. Virus doesn't give a damn about societal issues. It's either a pandemic or it's not.

Let the protesters protest but give the exact same non enforcement of COVID restrictions to everything else. End all COVID restrictions other than "suggesting" 6' spacing and wearing a mask. End all mandates. Period.

Allowing the protests is putting millions at risk depriving their right to live OR the restrictions are unnecessary and should be criminal for crashing the economy, financially devastating millions, etc.

There simply is no grey area here. It is or it isn't.
I live in Laramie. I see protestors on Grand avenue any time I feel like driving over and seeing them. They are protesting the injustices they see. I don't blame them. There really aren't many COVID restrictions here in Wyoming. If I drive to Colorado, I'm required to wear a mask. I always wear one down there. I'm about 50/50 here in Laramie.

Pandemics infect whoever they can find. It just unmasks much of the inequities that exist in our society today. BTW, I've seen plenty of pictures of the protests where they are socially distanced correctly. I've also seen plenty where they are not. Saw the same thing in the grocery store the other day. Its not limited to protestors.

At the end of the day, there is a significant portion of this country that is more susceptible to COVID-19 because of their social status. There is also a significant portion that is more susceptible to police violence for many of the same reasons. Hell, I saw the protesters calling out Derick Colling the other day.
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bladerunnr wrote: Sat Jun 06, 2020 8:18 am
WyoBrandX wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:17 pm
ragtimejoe1 wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:44 am
I wasn't aware of any states allowing mass gatherings of hundreds or thousands of people? Perhaps you can point me in that direction. If the march in Casper today exceeds 250 people, will the governor intervene? Will the march be shut down? We'll see, but I doubt it. If over 250 people congregate in Casper, how is that ok but not at a local fair, rodeo, or church?

How is it remotely legal to enforce social distancing and crowd restrictions going forward?
Perhaps they covered their mouths and stayed six feet apart? My wife asked me the other day about the protests in casper. She said - everyone laying on Wyoming Blvd in Casper is a bunch of idiots. I told her she was right. However, there is a big difference. Those protestors had a first amendment right to be there. Nobody has a right to drive. Its a privilege granted to you via a license.

The protestors have more of a right to be there and tell us what they want than we have to drive on the same road. Let that sink in for a moment.

We need to do better. We need to improve all human rights. WE need to demiltorize our police departments (it was never necessary in the first place.) And for god sakes, most of us need to quit listening to the goddamn propaganda.
The biggest load of [#]sh#t I've ever read. People have a first amendment right to protest. They do not have a right to block public access to roads and buildings. It is illegal in most, if not all, jurisdictions to do so. I pray that you did not go to UW, because your knowledge of basic law is moronic.
Your entitled to your own opinions. Your not entitled to your own facts.

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
I'm not going to say anything further than that. And I'm not going to call you names over your opinions either.
WyoBrandX
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Wyokie wrote: Sat Jun 06, 2020 12:20 pm
WyoBrandX wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:03 pm If you want equality, fairness, and all that, I think there are a few things that we can do - and they go far beyond the current affairs:

1.) All reservations should be able to have 2 senators - and at least 1 representative in the house. Give the indegenious persons more of a voice in government.

2.) For every elected seat in the senate and house, there should be an opposite the deed available. Eg Wyoming should have 2 female senators, 2 male senators, 1 female rep, and 1 male rep.

And we need to focus on getting everyone on an equal playing field.
I agree. I also would add TERM LIMITS for anyone elected!!!!!! Problem with you idea, WyoBrandX, is that we'd have to build a much larger Congress building to house both sides whenever they meet to vote and stuff..

I got a couple of friends on Facebook who acting as of this is the beginning of the end i.e., the religious apocalypse, which drives me nuts since I'm atheist!!!!! And I got other friends who are going full on tinfold hat conspiracy theorist mode!!!!!! :roll: It feels like I'm the last sane person on the planet!!!!!
I think there should be term limits on every office. They should have a 2 term consecutive limit. They should be required to take 1 term off after that, before running for another office.

If you get a good president in there, he/she/schlee gets elected to two terms, they need to be gone. If they really did that great, they should be able to run again after taking some time off (by time off - I mean politics, period).

I think that holds true for any public office. If that can't be done, term limits, 2 terms, period.
WyoBrandX
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laxwyo wrote: Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:51 pm WyoBrandX, here’s some light reading. Start thinking objectively instead of emotionally

https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/publi ... -use-force#

Don’t trust anyone who screams racism. We’re literally living in the safest and least racist time in the history of civilization. Does racism exist? Sure. I’d argue it’s not coming from white folks. Does policing need reformed? You bet.
Hah. I have read that. And your right mostly. I don't think there is a better time in america than the last few years.

I was raised very poor. We didn't have a telephone. We always somehow had food on the table, but not necessarily electricity at the same time to enjoy dinner in the light.

It goes back generations. My great-great-great-great grandfather died at 88 in 1868 in near douglas after being kicked in the head by a mule. They didn't own the property, and it never was inherited by my great grandparents, grandparents, etc.

I pulled myself out of this cycle. It wasn't easy. I probably could have went a number of ways. But I look back at my success and realize that I had a few great opportunities that I took upon myself. And I dug out of it. I'm glad I did. I've been able to help my family immensely.

I'm going to utter two words I really hate ever being applied to anyone. But its important to shut the brain down for a minute and try to put yourself in the other persons position. White Privilege . I find these two words a bit offensive, and at the same time, only as of late, interesting.

I've lived in big cities, and I'm glad to be back in Wyoming. I like no traffic, simple life, etc. I like the outdoors.

I've said quite a few times - I don't have white privilege, i was lucky to get out of what I was born into for many generations. I worked for it, and everyone should be able to work for it. And I'm partially right.

If you look at how many people we have in prison in this country, most of them haven't done anything deserving of the prison sentence they received, you have to ask yourself - what just happened?

Most of the people we have in prison probably should be out in society working and paying taxes instead of being behind bars and consuming taxes. Think about this. Why do you put a person in a cage for a long period of time? Would you put a dog in a cage 23 hours a day for 10 years? No. You put people in prison because if they are loose in society they hurt people consistently and unrepairably. (murder/rape/etc).

The people evading taxes - well, there's alot of better ways to handle that. Confiscate their assets and get them back to work paying their back taxes.

The people that keep speeding - get a ticket - then lose their license, well, put a damn ankle bracelet on them. Get them back to work that afternoon - they keep paying taxes (and with only the cost of supervision/braclets) who cares.

Instead, we have 25% of the worlds prison population in the USA with only 3% of the worlds total population. Its stupid, its a drain, and its not equal.

We can continue pushing people down to make ourselves rise, our we can do our best to lift everyone up with us. I'd rather live in a country where we do try to pull everyone up vs push them down.

Racism is real. Police brutality is real (anyone remember Robbie Rameriz being shot in the back for driving to slow?)
ragtimejoe1
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WyoBrandX wrote: Sun Jun 07, 2020 7:32 pm
ragtimejoe1 wrote: Sat Jun 06, 2020 7:04 am @WyoBrandX

Horse crap. COVID restrictions are for everyone but protesters. Either COVID restrictions are necessary and should be enforced or not.

Look at the pictures. The protests are not following guidelines yet governors, media, etc are supporting them.

Pandemics don't work like that. You either have a pandemic that requires measures enforced EQUALLY or you do not. It is cut and dry science. Virus doesn't give a damn about societal issues. It's either a pandemic or it's not.

Let the protesters protest but give the exact same non enforcement of COVID restrictions to everything else. End all COVID restrictions other than "suggesting" 6' spacing and wearing a mask. End all mandates. Period.

Allowing the protests is putting millions at risk depriving their right to live OR the restrictions are unnecessary and should be criminal for crashing the economy, financially devastating millions, etc.

There simply is no grey area here. It is or it isn't.
At the end of the day, there is a significant portion of this country that is more susceptible to COVID-19 because of their social status. There is also a significant portion that is more susceptible to police violence for many of the same reasons. Hell, I saw the protesters calling out Derick Colling the other day.
Still a load of BS. Laws or regulations are what they are and for everyone or not. The virus infects all and is indiscriminate of social status; that's a fact and science.

Either a governor fully enforces restrictions for all or not. There is no grey area. It is a pandemic that requires these measures or it is not. Wyoming still has 250 people limit which was clearly violated in Casper and the protests were supported by the local municipalities by not enforcing COVID restrictions.

I'm not saying the protests should be shut down. I'm saying if COVID isn't a big enough deal to shut them down, then COVID isn't a big enough of a deal to shut anything down or have any restrictions just suggestions.
WYO1016 wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 8:10 am I'm starting to think that Burman has been laying the pipe to ragtimejoe1's wife
Insults are the last resort of fools with a crumbling position.
ragtimejoe1
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Haha,

So it begins:
A North Carolina speedway drew a crowd of more than 2,000 spectators in defiance of the state’s coronavirus restrictions after declaring the race a “protest.”
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... Q4Bg1Ka9rw
WYO1016 wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 8:10 am I'm starting to think that Burman has been laying the pipe to ragtimejoe1's wife
Insults are the last resort of fools with a crumbling position.
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laxwyo
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WyoBrandX, I completely and utterly agree with you about prison. We’ve made criminals out of people for doing things that aren’t criminal. If there’s no victim, there’s no crime. It’s also a great argument against gun control. You make a law that creates criminals for doing nothing criminal. Smoking weed in your house, no victim no crime. Unfortunately lots of laws were created that disproportionately affected minorities, that needs to change. Oddly enough, trump and republicans are leading this movement, not democrats. Be well
W-Y, Until I Die!
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