Men's Basketball Attendance Poll

[WyoBrandX]

I thought about this more and more. My parents are die hard fans - far more die hard than I am. They used drive 4 hours down to see at least 1-2 football games and 1-2 basketball games a year. They never did when the games were on TV. Same with all of their friends.

They never come down to Laramie anymore. The games are on TV. They can have some beers and watch it on TV or at the bar. Then they can go on with their day.

I think if you want to increase attendance, take the games of TV, serve some beer, or increase Laramie's population.

[BeaverPoke]

Why ask people on Wyonation.com why people aren't coming to games? Ask the people who aren't the internet forum die hards. My dad used to come down to Laramie from Evanston for at least 1 or 2 football games a year, same with basketball. As did many of his friends. I do not remember the last Pokes game he went to. I think the last BYU-Wyo football game we won in Laramie. 2003? But since then, he and his friends have no interest in coming down. To them it's just not worth it. Seriously why drive 4 hours from Evanston to Laramie to watch us lose on the hardwood or football field year, after year, after year.

And the students? People think we have some of the greatest fans/students out there. I don't. I think we suck.
Hell I'm a student right now and had an extra csu-wyo ticket for last night and couldn't find any takers for a free ticket. They would rather go party. Our students don't care about UW sports at all.

And some of the gameday atmosphere sucks, like many have pointed out, stupid "guess the price of the car" ads and crap like that. When Wyo goes on a big run and the opposing coach calls a timeout, students need to get the W-Y-O cheer going, not guess the frickin car.

And we cannot say f-word or poop without that douchey security guard threatening to kick us out. Like really wtf? Down in MobyDick Arena last night their students (WAY MORE THAN OURS!) were chanting f-word WY-OMING. Chanting Bull-poop.

Not to mention I've seen LPD arrest innocent kids at football games because someone else puked next to him so cops saw the puke and took him away.

Go to a game @Oregon State and see how much more fun (and packed) it is than U-Wyo. And the Beavers sucked last year, their stadium hold about 13,000 more too.

Wyoming fans just do not care, is my whole point. Plain and simple.

[McPeachy]

Why ask people on Wyonation.com why people aren't coming to games?

Ask the people who aren't the internet forum die hards.

1. Because people on Wyonation have good insight, have peers / friends that are "fans" and have an inside track at knowledge that is easily accessible. It is "of opinion" anyway.

2. That is almost impossible to do. Not only costly, but time consuming, and would have a huge variance. And how would they be identified? UW would never embark on such a task.

[BeaverPoke]

Why ask people on Wyonation.com why people aren't coming to games?

Ask the people who aren't the internet forum die hards.

1. Because people on Wyonation have good insight, have peers / friends that are "fans" and have an inside track at knowledge that is easily accessible. It is "of opinion" anyway.

2. That is almost impossible to do. Not only costly, but time consuming, and would have a huge variance. And how would they be identified? UW would never embark on such a task.

I didn't mean it literally, I mean why don't we all ask people we know that do not go to the games, why they aren't going to games. It doesn't have to be a series of polls and random phone calls by the University.

If Wyo wants to really increase attendance then they can make it happen. It's not like it's some impossible task.

[bladerunnr]

I think all the bases have been covered. I would throw in the fact that byu and Utah are gone. Those were big games and lot easier to get up for than air force or boise st. There's something about the smugness of byu that made me go those games more than others.

[McPeachy]

I didn't mean it literally, I mean why don't we all ask people we know that do not go to the games, why they aren't going to games. It doesn't have to be a series of polls and random phone calls by the University.

If Wyo wants to really increase attendance then they can make it happen. It's not like it's some impossible task.

Got it.

And I agree, if WYO really wants to increase attendance they can. Lot of bad decisions / processes / people put in place that killed the men's hoops attendance. Like the Josh Rebholz ticket / CJC premium. Or the Burman - Shroyer hire & EXTENSION mess. And the .mtn. And plenty of other not-so-transparent-if-you-look staff decisions.

[calpoke25]

I think all the bases have been covered. I would throw in the fact that byu and Utah are gone. Those were big games and lot easier to get up for than air force or boise st. There's something about the smugness of byu that made me go those games more than others.

The used to be true.... but whens the last time we sold out a BYU or Utah football game? The 90's maybe? I think the last 2 times BYU came to Laramie we had something like 15K and 19K at the football games. The same could be said for BBALL. Nothing more than average, and neither game had poor weather.

[WyoExpat]

When was the last time we sold out a BYU or Utah football game? The 90's maybe? I think the last 2 times BYU came to Laramie we had something like 15K and 19K at the football games. The same could be said for BBALL. Nothing more than average, and neither game had poor weather.

You are setting up a false standard here. We rarely sold out football games against any opponent. Apart from some high-profile, non-conference games like Nebraska this past year, it is more appropriate to look at attendance for games hosing BYU or Utah against the season average for the season in question. Many years, the 19K attendance number would have probably been in the top two for home games. I am not saying that we drew well for BYU and Utah. I am just saying that we drew better for BYU and Utah than we drew for most other opponents in the given year. CSU and Air Force have historically drawn comparably for football games.

Additionally, when we were fielding 3-4 win teams and hosting a National top-ten Utah team, people might not have been inspired to show up well for a game that they expected to turn ugly. That also speaks to the discouragement that became a part of our athletic programs for a few years in the past decade.

Basketball was a similar story. When we had a team that did draw greater-than-usual fan interest, then the BYU and Utah home games were the often the best chance for an extremely large (if not sellout) home crowd. My bet is that, if BYU were set to arrive in Laramie on one of the final two Saturdays of the conference season this year, and if we could have avoided the Air Force loss, then the that BYU game would have a good chance of having the highest attendance of the year. I think it would draw better than if the SDSU games were reversed and we hosted the Aztecs going down the stretch instead of traveling to San Diego.

How many of the top 15-25 attendance games in either major sport were played against BYU or Utah? I expect that those two teams, plus CSU, make up a large portion of the best-attended home games.

[Wyovanian]

I think there's a pretty clear correlation between the televised games and the drop in attendance. The basketball season simply falls during the worst part of the winter travel season, and, though no one wants to really admit it, the reason so many folks made the trip was because it was the only way to see the game. After three years of Schroyer gave them an excuse to stop coming, many, locals included, found staying at home or heading to a bar was a better experience as far as watching the game. No having to go outside, no having to deal with icy streets, no having to scrape windshields after the game, no having to deal with traffic after the game, AND they can drink to their enlarged livers' content.

If any market in the MWC should look at a local blackout of games, it's Wyoming. At the same time, however, if they just resign themselves to and speed up the inevitable and permit beer sales (the camel's nose is in the suites already) they'd offset the hard feelings caused by local blackout.

[McPeachy]

At the same time, however, if they just resign themselves to and speed up the inevitable and permit beer sales (the camel's nose is in the suites already) they'd offset the hard feelings caused by local blackout.

We will all get to shake hands with god before that happens. Unfortunately.

Besides, it is cheaper, and a lot more fun, to sneak it in.

[WyoExpat]

Since this team doesn't really have a star, maybe casual fans aren't as interested to come to the games.

I think that Leonard Washington is actually on the verge of being star material. Pay attention to how versatile he is. Not many teams match up well with him. He got into foul trouble against CSU and when the shooters go cold in the second half teams can sag back in on him and on Waddell. But when he is getting fed the ball with room to work early in the games he is a beast to watch.

I also think folks need to start enjoying the development of Larry Nance. There is a reason that his minutes are increasing, and it is not only out of desperation. He is growing as a player.

The big difference is that out top guys are not perimeter players that we can feed on the wing for isolation offense.

[Wyovanian]

At the same time, however, if they just resign themselves to and speed up the inevitable and permit beer sales (the camel's nose is in the suites already) they'd offset the hard feelings caused by local blackout.

We will all get to shake hands with god before that happens. Unfortunately.

Besides, it is cheaper, and a lot more fun, to sneak it in.

Agree with the last part, but as to the first- had you told someone five years ago that beer would be available at Wyoming home football games, they'd've likely told you the same thing.

[McPeachy]

Agree with the last part, but as to the first- had you told someone five years ago that beer would be available at Wyoming home football games, they'd've likely told you the same thing.

Think back to your days in Laramie...

Beer (et al) has been available at the War since I can remember...Presidents & AD box (in the press box on the west side).

Beer at the gardens since before I was born, beer on Frat row since before I was born, catered functions all over campus, the ballrooms - MPG - FH - Old Main, etc., all served beer etc. And if anything it has become more regulated...not less.

Too many folks still "in charge" think it would be a mistake to have beer around the "young en's"...aka students. Hence the $2,000+ price tag per seat in the WC where beer is available.

[WyoExpat]

Why even mess with the game? The main point is to have an excuse for beer anyway, isn't it? Beer first, last and always! This is Wyoming so gotta have one or two for the road as well.

[Wyovanian]

Agree with the last part, but as to the first- had you told someone five years ago that beer would be available at Wyoming home football games, they'd've likely told you the same thing.

Think back to your days in Laramie...

Beer (et al) has been available at the War since I can remember...Presidents & AD box (in the press box on the west side).

Beer at the gardens since before I was born, beer on Frat row since before I was born, catered functions all over campus, the ballrooms - MPG - FH - Old Main, etc., all served beer etc. And if anything it has become more regulated...not less.

Too many folks still "in charge" think it would be a mistake to have beer around the "young en's"...aka students. Hence the $2,000+ price tag per seat in the WC where beer is available.

All true, but the availability of alcohol up in the press box wasn't widely known outside of people who've been up there. Anyone willing to spend can get access to the Wildcatter, and beer, now. Quite a bit different scenario.

And as far as the folks "in charge" who're anti-alcohol, their ranks are thinning as fast as their vascular walls are thickening.

[WyoExpat]

While I am not exactly a teetotaler and I have no opposition to a beer and a dog at the ballpark, I do not know what I think of the idea that a whole bunch of Wyomingites refuse to attend games because they cannot get a few more beers during that two-hour window.

How many people are there in Wyoming that simply will not go someplace or do something that does not include beer? Is that number in the hundreds or in the thousands?

[BeaverPoke]

While I am not exactly a teetotaler and I have no opposition to a beer and a dog at the ballpark, I do not know what I think of the idea that a whole bunch of Wyomingites refuse to attend games because they cannot get a few more beers during that two-hour window.

How many people are there in Wyoming that simply will not go someplace or do something that does not include beer? Is that number in the hundreds or in the thousands?

I would say thousands. I know a lot of people who will not go to a restaurant if they can not get a beer. It's not that they want to get wasted everywhere they go but a beer or two would be nice.

[WyoExpat]

I think there's a pretty clear correlation between the televised games and the drop in attendance.
...
If any market in the MWC should look at a local blackout of games, it's Wyoming.

I have heard an alternate theory that basically argues that TV/radio broadcasts should drive up interest among fans to actually travel to see games live.

TV is there to see what the team is about and to follow the suspense through the outcome. Attendance is the only way to experience the whole event. To the extent that they over-produce the games in the A-A, it hurts disconnects the fans that are there from the game. The fans should be able to participate in the event. The Athletic Dept. gets to charge for that experience.

Additionally there is an opportunity to network. The target audience is alumni who, ideally, are putting their UW degrees to work and getting paid better than non-alumni...ideally. (?!)

[Wyovanian]

I think there's a pretty clear correlation between the televised games and the drop in attendance.
...
If any market in the MWC should look at a local blackout of games, it's Wyoming.

I have heard an alternate theory that basically argues that TV/radio broadcasts should drive up interest among fans to actually travel to see games live.

TV is there to see what the team is about and to follow the suspense through the outcome. Attendance is the only way to experience the whole event. To the extent that they over-produce the games in the A-A, it hurts disconnects the fans that are there from the game. The fans should be able to participate in the event. The Athletic Dept. gets to charge for that experience.

Additionally there is an opportunity to network. The target audience is alumni who, ideally, are putting their UW degrees to work and getting paid better than non-alumni...ideally. (?!)

That theory might work in places where going outside doesn't involve an astronautical process of dressing followed by treacherous, icy streets, a walk of at least a block to get inside, then facing the same walk and a fully frozen vehicle post-game. Couple that with no chance of a beer-with-the-hot dog at the ball game and you have a scenario where people can rationalize a more enjoyable game experience at home or in a neighborhood tavern with curbside parking and a short walk inside.

Wyoming weather presents some interesting marketing difficulties when one is trying to get 10,000+ people to a game from a potential audience of about 100,000 within a one hour (in normal conditions) drive. If that population can see the game without dealing with the weather and eat and drink whatever they like, that provides pretty strong rationale for not going to the game.

And I've never been to a serious business networking mixer that didn't offer "social lubricant" for those that so desire.

[WyoExpat]

That theory might work in places where going outside doesn't involve an astronautical process of dressing followed by treacherous, icy streets, a walk of at least a block to get inside, then facing the same walk and a fully frozen vehicle post-game. Couple that with no chance of a beer-with-the-hot dog at the ball game and you have a scenario where people can rationalize a more enjoyable game experience at home or in a neighborhood tavern with curbside parking and a short walk inside.

Wyoming weather presents some interesting marketing difficulties when one is trying to get 10,000+ people to a game from a potential audience of about 100,000 within a one hour (in normal conditions) drive. If that population can see the game without dealing with the weather and eat and drink whatever they like, that provides pretty strong rationale for not going to the game.

And I've never been to a serious business networking mixer that didn't offer "social lubricant" for those that so desire.

1) We may have to agree to disagree about the seriousness of the bundling-up issue in Wyoming. That is routine for any travel in Wyoming. People put on warm coats and hats several times per day anyway. I never missed a game based on weather alone...unless the Summit was closed.

2) Paragraph #2 is the crux and essence of the attendance issue. I would say the solutions are far above the pay grade of the athletic department, except the coaches get paid multiples of the salaries of the people who are responsible for the root causes of a low population in the most densely-populated commercial centers of the state. That is part of what makes Wyoming Wyoming, but that also has consequences.

3) I have not been to one like that either, but I doubt people refuse to attend based on the absence of drinks. I suspect that they lubricate those who would attend anyway. I am not dogmatic here.

In the end, solve issue #2, ideally by growing employment for graduates of the university itself and I suspect the rest will take care of itself.